Are Republicans trying to steal another election?

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There's always next year, like in 75, 90-93, 99 &
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http://www.msnbc.com/news/955980.asp?0cv=CB20

California Gov. Gray Davis has blasted the recall effort against him as a Republican power grab.

Subversion of democracy

Are Republicans trying to steal elections they cannot win?

By Timothy Noah
SLATE.COM

Aug. 22 — According to Adam Nagourney of The New York Times, Bill Clinton has provided California Gov. Gray Davis with an interesting way to look at the movement to recall him from office. Here is how the Clinton-coached Davis put it in the Aug. 19 kickoff of his anti-recall campaign:

THIS RECALL is bigger than California. What’s happening here is part of an ongoing national effort to steal elections Republicans cannot win.
It started with the impeachment of President Clinton, when the Republicans could not beat him in 1996. It continued in Florida, where they stopped the vote count, depriving thousands of Americans of the right to vote.
This year, they’re trying to steal additional congressional seats in Colorado and Texas, overturning legal redistricting plans. Here in California, the Republicans lost the governor’s race last November. Now they’re trying to use this recall to seize control of California just before the next presidential election.”

BETWEEN THE LINES
Al Sharpton, who is a lousy presidential candidate but an excellent phrase-maker, calls the GOP’s strategy, “Let’s do it again until I win.”

Is the criticism fair? To answer that, let’s break the accusation down into two parts:
1) Republicans are subverting democracy to unseat the opposition.
and
2) They’re doing this more than the Democrats.
Now let’s consider whether these two assertions apply to Clinton and Davis’ litany of examples. I clarified his thinking on these topics by consulting two smart opinion journalists who hold opposing views — Joshua Micah Marshall of Talking Points Memo and David Tell of the Weekly Standard. Neither should be held responsible for the conclusions that appear below. These are my own and inevitably reflect distinctions that are somewhat subjective.

TALE OF THE TAPE
“It started with the impeachment of President Clinton, when the Republicans could not beat him in 1996.” This one’s pretty simple: Clinton’s impeachment did subvert his democratic election, and Democrats haven’t lately tried to do the same to a Republican president (unless you count the movement 30 years ago to impeach Nixon, which was a bipartisan response to crimes of the state that stemmed from the Nixon White House’s own effort to subvert the 1972 election). My only quibble is that the Republican effort to unseat Clinton actually preceded the 1996 election, though it didn’t really snowball until afterward. (The “vast right-wing conspiracy” began as a small conspiracy conducted by a shockingly well-funded nut fringe.)

From the start it was very clearly motivated by the desire to remove Clinton from office; the conservative groups that funded Jones v. Clinton surprised no one when they failed, subsequently, to persist in combating the social evil of sexual harassment.
Tell argues that the removal of Clinton from office wouldn’t have subverted any elections because Clinton would have been replaced by Vice President Al Gore, whom the electorate twice approved as Clinton’s replacement, should one be needed. (In that respect, the Clinton impeachment was more democratic than Nixon’s near-impeachment, which resulted in Nixon’s resignation and the installation of Gerald Ford, whom the national electorate had not approved.) “I would have been perfectly content if Al Gore had been president,” says Tell, “and he’s no Republican.” But if Gore had been needed to take Clinton’s place, it would have been because of Clinton’s forced removal from the office to which he was twice elected. Voters had approved not a Gore presidency but the contingency of a Gore presidency. The person they’d elected president was Clinton.

THE LONG COUNT
“It continued in Florida, where they stopped the vote count, depriving thousands of Americans of the right to vote.” This is a much harder case, and in many respects, Marshall points out, it’s sui generis. “Neither side planned to get into that situation ahead of time,” Marshall says, and that makes it “different in kind from these other cases where arguably the Republicans planned to win political contests by illegitimate or unconventional means.” To the extent people behaved badly, it was spontaneous bad behavior.

Deciding whether it was the Democrats or the Republicans who behaved anti-democratically during the Long Count, Tell observes, “would depend entirely on how you viewed the merits of each respective side.” Conservatives can (and do) argue that Gore started the whole thing by demanding a recount, something presidential candidates (notably, Nixon in 1960) had customarily avoided doing publicly for many years. (Privately was another matter; as Slate’s David Greenberg has pointed out, the GOP, though it lacked candidate Nixon’s public support, nonetheless waged various recount challenges and ended up moving Hawaii’s three electoral votes from Kennedy to Nixon. The outcome was unaffected.) However, if we focus on the fact that Gore was trying to count votes while Bush was trying to stop the counting of votes, and that Bush ultimately persuaded the (unelected) Supreme Court to do just that even though the Florida counts were very, very close, it’s the Republicans who subverted democracy.
The real villain of the Long Count, though, was neither the Democrats nor the Republicans. It was the Electoral College, which denied Gore the presidency even though he won the popular vote. Let’s get rid of it.

REDISTRICTING
“This year, they’re trying to steal additional congressional seats in Colorado and Texas, overturning legal redistricting plans.” This one’s a split decision. It’s undeniable that the departure from the orderly tradition of reapportioning congressional seats once every 10 years was brought about by Republicans. Marshall, who has written extensively on this subject, points out that before Republicans starting redrawing political maps in Texas and Colorado, no state legislature had second-guessed a decennial redistricting for purely political reasons since the 1950s. “This is completely unprecedented in modern political history,” he says.

Clearly, it’s disruptive and poisonously partisan to redraw congressional districts every time control of a state legislature shifts from one party to another. But you can’t really say it subverts democracy. Quite the opposite: It empowers democracy too much. Allowing a momentary change in the popular will to force unwarranted changes, though bad government, is nonetheless democratic government. It’s democracy on steroids, which can be just as harmful as democracy subverted.

DO YOU RECALL?
“Here in California, the Republicans lost the governor’s race last November. Now they’re trying to use this recall to seize control of California just before the next presidential election.” Davis is mostly on firm ground here. He is the victim of a uniquely Republican practice; I am unaware of any previous instance in which Democrats managed to get a gubernatorial recall vote onto the ballot less than a year after the governor in question, who had not been accused of committing any crimes, was elected. (Slate’s Andy Bowers informs us that only once in American history has a governor been removed by recall, and that was more than 80 years ago.)

Is it anti-democratic? No, in the limited sense that the gathering of recall petitions is a democratic process. Seen in this light, California’s recall mechanism is another example of democracy on steroids. In a more meaningful sense, though, it is anti-democratic because if Davis is removed from office, it’s entirely possible — indeed, likely — that he will be replaced by someone who received fewer votes than Davis did in last year’s election. (The recall vote and the “who should replace Davis” vote are on the same ballot, dealt with as two separate questions. That eliminates the winnowing you’d get in a primary.)

FINAL VERDICT
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Would the removal of Davis and his replacement by a Republican affect the presidential contest in 2004? Possibly. But that’s fairly speculative. And the ways in which a governor can influence a presidential vote are sufficiently indirect that, were the recall to install a Republican in the nation’s most populous state, I would still hesitate to call that a subversion of democracy in the next presidential election.
So, in assessing the components of the Clinton-Davis message, we have one yes, one maybe, one yes and no, and one mostly yes. The chair therefore rules Republicans more or less guilty as charged of conducting “an ongoing national effort to steal elections Republicans cannot win.”
 

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I don't think you believe half the shit you post.

I'll admit I don't have time to read that propaganda you posted, however, about 60+% want Davis out. There's only about 40% or so republicans in california so the #'s just don't add up. Davis sucks and Arnie won't be much better. End of story.
 

There's always next year, like in 75, 90-93, 99 &
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Out,
I clearly cited both the author and the news site, so you should direct your concerns to MSNBC.

Perhaps if you had taken your hood off then your vision would not have been hinder and you may not have overlooked the citations.

Thanks.
 
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Considering California's present state is due mainly to right-sided dereg. of electricity, I would say lander's question is near perfectly timed.
 

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Neither California nor any other state in the US has ever come anywhere near deregulation of the power industry. Just because they call it "deregulation" does not mean a thing, except that the media and consumer groups and political officials can then blame the resulting problems on "greedy corporations" and the dumbass public will believe it.


Phaedrus
 

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In fairness, the other side is just as dirty & would probably steal an election if they could.

This one doesn't bother me, but perhaps it's because I'm not directly effected.

I'm a bit surprised that Clinton rad to Davis' side as it certainly can't help Bill or Hillary.
 

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Something that really fries my butt over the Dem whining about the recall and about Republican gerrymandering is that it was alright to do these things when it was to the Dems interests to do them. The Dems gerrymanderred Texas to the point that they still control a majority of the Texas representatives to congress, even though they're now the minority party in Taxas. And Gray Davis and the Dems used the recall some 40 times over the past dozen years - and never mentioned a worde about the citizens votes when it was in their favor!~
Geez - please quit whining about this stuff - the Dems sound more and more like a spoilt rich kid who wants to stay up late.
Do me a favor - shut up and go to bed!

Lander - it sounds nice to hear a socialist sucking it in and acting like a man! Please keep up the good Republican works!
Thanks,
 

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The dems here in TX have made absolute clowns of themselves by running to the hills when they are going to lose a vote. Kinda reminds us of Nazi Germany. When they were in power they steam rolled the republicans on re-districting, atleast the republicans were man enough to show for the vote.
 

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You should re-read these pages, RFC, and think carefully about them -- there are no examplesof deregulation of the power industry in the UNited States today, despite there being five areas which are called "deregulated."

In California, for instance, the wholesale power industry was deregulated to an extent, while the retail industry was kept on the same short leash as always. A major contributor to the bankrupticy of PG&L was the fact that there was no limit to what an energy producer could charge for power generation, but strict caps on what a retailer could charge the end user. Is this not a recipe for disaster in and of itself?

Also, Americans and their politicans think of power as an "essential" industry, as they do many others (steel, aitlines, insurance, agriculture, automotive, on and on.) Therefore the power industry gets artificially propped up through subsidies and tax breaks that give it a false sense of security and even prosperity.

A truly deregulated power industry would not have such features, and if there was a problem with blackouts or price gouging then competition would weed it out within a few years. The problem lies in special interest groups (including those within the power industry itself) who refuse to get off the dole -- environmentalists, conusmer advocates, etc.

In many aspects of the American economy, consumers enjoy goods and services for far less than they should actually cost -- and electric power is an exemplary case. If power companies were allowed to develop power capacity and transmission lines as needed, and charge an appropriate price to the users of that power, the cost of electricity would be at least double what it is now on average -- but it would be a true assessment of the cost, and the industry would flourish -- as would the society enjoying abundant electricity.

Again, there is no deregulation of power in the United States and never has been, and frankly there is not likely to be any time in the future until we're all sitting in the fvcking dark wondering what happened.


Phaedrus
 

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Why the edit? I was looking forward to hearing what Phaedrus had to say.

wil.
 

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I would have liked to have seen it myself, for or against my point of view.

An interesting piece by D.W. MacKenzie at Mises.org today about the myth of deregulation in America, and on the increasing prevalence of the asinine belief that if the American consumer finds a particular good or service to be useful (power, food, steel) that that individual has somehow acquired a 'right' to that good or service. The primary case used in the piece is the cable television industry, called 'deregulated' since 1996 in the U.S.

An excerpt:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><font size="-1">quote:</font><HR>

It is now common to hear about failures in privatization and deregulation, with even the New York blackout being blamed on too-little government (even though electric utilities are still heavily regulated). Of course, every reduction of government intervention in commerce has its critics. Partial deregulation of the type that has occurred in utilities, which leaves in place many regulations that hinder market competition, invites such criticism.

...

Complete privatization will not lead to ideal results, but it will unravel most of the anticompetitive practices that exist in the cable industry. The lesson that we should draw from the results of the Telecommunications Act of 1996 is that efforts to partially privatize the industry are likely to retain those elements of regulations that benefit concentrated interests in business most.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Full story here.


Phaedrus
 

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Sorry to keep on about it, but of course it's in the news a lot in the wake of the blackout. Russell Madden penned this piece i the LFE Times.

Blackout—or Blank-Out?
The Power Industry Is No More Deregulated than Airports Are


In a reflection of admirable entrepreneurial action, blackout t-shirts are selling briskly in the Big Apple. The version I saw on television sported a New York City skyline inked in black with the years 1965, 1977, and 2003 written below. Apparently, some who endured this latest in-your-face blip want to commemorate the occasion. Perhaps the relatively benign nature of this interruption in their daily routines brought a rush of relief to New Yorkers glad that they were not staring into the blank eyes of a 9-11-01 doppelganger.

The mental and emotional changes wrought in the psyches of these big-city denizens by the destruction of the World Trade Center may help explain the party atmosphere that spread through the streets and neighborhoods of New York City. Impromptu gatherings clustered around sources of light, providing echoes of distant ancestors hunkered about sputtering campfires defying dangers lurking in the night. People sang and talked and met new friends, rejoicing in companionship with strangers as they shed the mental shields so endemic in crowded urban environments.

Businesses gave away or sold at cost perishable food. Pizza bakers labored in the flickering glow of their ovens as they worked to assuage the hunger of the wandering masses. That ancient symbol of fellowship — alcohol — passed among people weary from the heat and stress of a long afternoon and evening. Prohibitions against drinking in public — silly even in normal circumstances — were set aside in the face of tipped beer bottles and uncorked wine.

In the absence of electricity and police manpower, traffic lights gave way to unasked volunteers directing traffic, both wheeled and afoot. Spontaneous order emerged from chaos without the omniscient eye of the State micromanaging the affairs of ordinary folks. Stranded commuters hitched rides home...and often succeeded in their quests for transportation. Trucks carried scores of workers clinging to their sides like barnacles on a ship. Buses bulged with unaccustomed riders, lumbering and belching their ways through the snarled streets.

Bit by bit, ferries thinned the massive crowds flowing like lemmings towards the water separating Manhattan from the mainland. Darkened subways disgorged their passengers, many of those modern castaways helped towards the light by individuals younger or stronger or calmer. Pedestrians yielded to emergency vehicles.

People survived.

Admirable, yes. In the face of frustration and inconvenience, in the reality of disruption and twittering fear, average people remained calm and did what had to be done. Police and firefighters did their jobs, the jobs they should do: protect and serve those whose taxes pay their wages. No S.W.A.T. teams were required. No national guard troops. No military brigades. A lesson that hopefully will extend beyond this specific event.

Once terrorists — excuse me: terrorism, in State-Speak — once terrorism was (apparently) ruled out as an initiating cause of this blackout, the vermin of the political class crawled forth from their fetid burrows. Such pointy-nosed rats as the wife of the former adulterer-in-chief lifted their snouts into the breeze of opportunism and proclaimed that "deregulation!" was at fault. Other snakes and insects (with all due apologies to the run-of-the-mill, natural pests), other noxious creatures took up the cry and demanded that the State create and enforce national standards lest our nation suffer similar or worse crises in the future. To allow the despicable power company officials to rely upon their own best judgment, to race unchecked after that ultimate evil, profit, would be the height of irresponsibility. Only the wise and powerful Oz, er, government bureaucrat possessed the intelligence, the benevolence, the skills and daring to defend the American public from the ravages of the greedy and callous capitalists providing us our electricity...

Imagine for a moment an editorial cartoon. Two panels. In the first, we see a man from the waist up. In fine cartoon tradition, written across his chest are the words "Electricity Production Industry." (This example is easily generalizable; simply substitute the whipping-boy-of-the-moment [for example, the "Airline Industry"] and the same point will be made.) Falling from his spreading arms are the severed remnants of a rope that is labeled "Regulations." A triumphant smile grows on the liberated man's face.

In the next panel, we have a wide shot showing the man's entire body. As he tries to stand, he is brought up short by iron chains wrapped securely about this legs. The chains are further locked down to a massive ring buried in the ground. The man's grin changes to one of consternation bordering on horror. Beneath this panel, we see the following caption: "A Politician's Idea of Deregulation."

The power industry is no more "deregulated" than are the airlines faced with government-owned airports, State-mandated and -controlled security measures, antismoking rules, passenger mandates, and the thousand-and-one other laws and regulations dictating how they can operate their businesses. But to the statists and the collectivists, any small loosening of the chains is equivalent to total freedom. Then, when the hobbled man is unable to run a four-minute mile, "deregulation" is deemed the culprit, and the industry must be reined in like a recalcitrant stallion on the verge of escape.

To hear mayors and senators and governors speak of the "public" power grid as though it belongs to and is a right of us all — of that metaphor, the "nation" — is to realize that the precepts and destructiveness of socialism and fascism are alive and well. Congress has no constitutional authority to dwiddle in the production of any brand of energy. Whether the issue is providing electricity or natural gas or oil for business or personal consumption, all politicians can do is muck things up. These eloquent ignoramuses have no legal — let alone moral — right to promote or to discourage nuclear reactors or hydroelectric dams or windmills or solar cells or anything else as a means of generating electricity.

These dolts ease up on production rules for electricity while refusing to relinquish transmission requirements, then they are shocked! shocked! at the results. These twits pretend that the safety of consumers will suffer if electric companies are left to their own devices but ignore their usurpation of control from the industry's very beginning. These jerks whine about prices then deny free and open competition among companies while preventing consumers from selecting among alternatives. These numskulls expect perfection from a handicapped system but conveniently forget their own innumerable mistakes and their hand in crippling the feedback function of prices.

We should not be surprised by such contradictions, of course. The kind of mentalities that brand NAFTA as "free" trade or babble on about our "free" society, our "free-market" economy, are blind (by choice or by habit) to the consequences of their own behavior. Scapegoating — blaming the victim — is what such slimy personalities do best.

The statists and collectivists want the goodies but without the bother of recognizing "unpleasant" causes. They desire limitless power on demand but minus the cost and sans any transmission lines or production plants in their own backyards. They seek to shackle the doers while demanding they serve us flawlessly.

The real problem facing America is not a rare blackout, even one resulting from human fallibility. It is the "blank out" that exists between causes and effects, between means and ends; a blank-out that denies the autonomy of the individual, that rejects the sanctity of the mind, that refuses to acknowledge that thinking is not a commodity that emerges from a socket.

We need to honor — not vilify — those whose diligence, hard work, and creativity make it possible for the rest of us to "take for granted" what they offer us: the producers, the struggling remnants of capitalism. If you truly and sincerely want to solve our energy problems, break their chains. All of them.
 

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